• Display name@feddit.nu
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    9 months ago

    Well it’s a one party dictatorship, and even though the sanctions at first might not have been for a good reason, the responsibility lies on the Cuban leadership.

    • MattsAlt [comrade/them]@hexbear.net
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      9 months ago

      So Cuba should dissolve a government widely approved of by the people and return to client state gang run institutions for the ability to receive food? You’re a fucking idiot. Calling people sith lords, please learn to engage in world politics by using meaningful vocabulary instead of trying to equate everything to your favorite work of fiction

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        9 months ago

        Hard to tell how popular the government is if you get jailed for voicing disagreement now isn’t it? What I’ve seen about the demand for the sanctions to be lifted it’s granting the population human rights regarding political freedoms. Would that mean the dissolvement of the government?

        • ExotiqueMatter@lemmygrad.ml
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          9 months ago

          Hard to tell how popular the government is if you get jailed for voicing disagreement now isn’t it?

          [citation needed]

          What I’ve seen about the demand for the sanctions to be lifted it’s granting the population human rights regarding political freedoms. Would that mean the dissolvement of the government?

          You’ve been given a link to a declassified CIA document in which they admit that the true objective of the sanctions is to have the Cuben government overthrown, did you read anything any of us have given you?

          • MeowZedong@lemmygrad.ml
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            9 months ago

            …did you read anything any of us have given you?

            Lol, you know liberals choose not to read. I’d poke fun by saying they can’t read, but that would be giving them too much credit.

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          9 months ago

          Meh, can you really say that it’s the proletarian dictatorship anymore when Cuba now has a privileged elite defending it’s grip on power against the poor majority? It’s more like they have become the bourgeoisie.

          • 420blazeit69 [he/him]@hexbear.net
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            9 months ago

            I’m sure you have some kind of a source for such an outlandish claim. How much time do you spend looking at the compensation of Cuban politicians?

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              9 months ago

              You could probably understand the reasoning if you read the rest of the thread. What kind of compensation do you have in mind?

              • 420blazeit69 [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                9 months ago

                I’ve read the thread. You have no source and you have not even tried to educate yourself on the basics of the Cuban government. You invented an accusation out of thin air and are somehow surprised people don’t uncritically believe it.

                • Display name@feddit.nu
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                  9 months ago

                  Alright, what do you request a source for? Can’t say I’m surprised at others not agreeing in a discussion. Do you usually get surprised by that?

                  • 420blazeit69 [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                    9 months ago

                    Cuba now has a privileged elite defending it’s grip on power against the poor majority

                    Source this.

                    You have done zero investigation into how well off Cuban leaders are compared to the average Cuban. You have done zero investigation into how this compares to peer countries.

                    You just made it up because it sounds like a Bad Country thing, someone told you once that Cuba is a Bad Country, and you never bothered to learn about the place yourself.

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            9 months ago

            Ah thanks. Maybe should have used the proper authoritarian. Dictatorship is just a much easier and more widely recognized term no?

            • well, every state is authoritarian. thats part of the self preservation of any governance, be it progressive or reactionary. if you wanna abolish states alltogether ask the anarchists, since i am an ml and think that authoritarian measures are good for the liberation of mankind.

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                9 months ago

                Haha yeah in a sense maybe. But the authoritarian meaning is that there’s no free or equal competition for the power so I mean there’s quite a difference between states where there are authoritan and democratic countries.

                • GarbageShoot [he/him]@hexbear.net
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                  9 months ago

                  equal competition for the power

                  Show me any state where there is an “equal competition for power” in any general sense. The Democrats and Republicans having similar degrees of power means nothing but a duopoly if they each exist above democracy as private entities (and they do) and there is no “equal” competition with more progressive groups.

    • 420blazeit69 [he/him]@hexbear.net
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      9 months ago

      You’re going to bat for the collective punishment of the Cuban people. When is the collective punishment of civilians appropriate in your mind?

      You’re also supporting a policy that has failed to achieve its stated result for 65 years. What other long-term policy failures do you support?

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        9 months ago

        Can’t say I would have objected against sanctions against Nazi Germany. Does that suffice?

        Please cite me where I state that I support this policy?

        • 420blazeit69 [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          9 months ago

          Please cite me where I state that I support this policy?

          You excused it by blaming it on Cuba. There’s no meaningful difference between that and support. Any worthwhile take on the embargo starts with ending it immediately, and you can’t even manage that.

          And sure, I would support sanctions against Nazi Germany. But until Cuba turns fascist, invades its neighbors, and starts a genocide, it’s nowhere near a situation where sanctions are appropriate.

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              9 months ago

              Use your words

              If you think there’s some meaningful difference, let’s hear what it is. “I don’t support this but it’s totally their fault” is not convincing.

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                9 months ago

                Of course there’s a difference with seeing something from an objective viewpoint and agreeing or disagreeing with it?

            • Kumikommunism [they/them]@hexbear.net
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              9 months ago

              Are you a sith lord?

              Well, if your horrible, uneducated, moronic, murderous political ideas didn’t already tell me that you have the mental capacity of someone who derives their political opinions from children’s media…There it is.

        • GarbageShoot [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          9 months ago

          Please cite me where I state that I support this policy?

          I hate when people try to be slick, and it’s even more annoying when they suck at it:

          Well it’s a one party dictatorship, and . . . the responsibility lies on the Cuban leadership.

          All this ignoring that you are misrepresenting both Cuba and the effect of the sanctions.

        • ExotiqueMatter@lemmygrad.ml
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          9 months ago

          You do realize that kind of sanctions affect the poor civilians far more than the elite, if it even affect the elite at all, right?

    • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
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      9 months ago

      How is the US engaging in a blockade around a country with a popular government the fault of the Cuban leadership?

    • Alsephina@lemmy.ml
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      9 months ago

      Yeah they should’ve had a dictatorship of two genocidal imperialist parties instead like the US

    • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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      9 months ago

      Well it’s a one party dictatorship

      Yes, the dictatorship of the party of the working class, or in other words a proletarian democracy.

      Meanwhile, whether one party or two or a hundred, we have a dictatorship of the capitalist class, or in other words a bourgeois democracy.

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        9 months ago

        I guess you could call stomping out peaceful protests with violence an act of terrorism? But that’s not the entire reason lol

        • plinky [he/him]@hexbear.net
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          9 months ago

          I guess you could call george floyd or la riots stomping a terrorist act thonk

          but for real, islands can’t survive on their own, if tomorrow uk stopped all trade, it will start starving in 2 months. usa sanctions are extra cruel with both finance and shipping conditions

            • я не из калининграда@lemmy.ml
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              9 months ago

              cuba and korea are already democratic, as in the sense of true democracy, workplace democracy. liberal “democracy” is nothing more than a cover for the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie and foreign imperialists. just look at cuba and korea under their respective american and japanese occupations. thats what the liberal west wants to return them to.

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                9 months ago

                Well “true” democracy is a rather open definition lol. With a minimalist definition enough even North Korea is a democracy based on them holding elections but I mean that is obviously not the case. Liberal democracy is just electoral democracy+ rule of law. You can have liberal democracy without capitalism and the bourgeoisie, just look at the Scandinavian countries before the neoliberalists took hold.

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                    9 months ago

                    ? The current Nordic model is hardly socialist, just a welfare model. But in the 60’s it was on its way to eradicate the bourgeoisie and lift the under class in its entirety?

                    Didn’t know it was a meme lol, what is it about?

                • ExotiqueMatter@lemmygrad.ml
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                  9 months ago

                  Sorry but Scandinavian countries were still capitalist and still had a bourgeois class even before the neoliberals came around.

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                9 months ago

                That is a very interesting question. “Stable dictatorships instead of unstable democracies.” Most of the liberal democracies in the world seem to prefer that 🤷 What made Japan make it to that list?

                The point still stands, whatever you think about the sanctions against Cuba, the leadership is responsible for it’s people and there’s a very easy way for them to have the sanctions lifted.

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                    9 months ago

                    Oh you mean like that! Yes that is a good point. Can it be considered democratic if you have a hegemony ruling for lengthy periods of time with no shift in power even though there is free and equal competition by the opposition. I think 2012 was the last time an oppositional party held power.

                • davel [he/him]@lemmy.ml
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                  9 months ago

                  Yes they can easily have the sanctions lifted by betraying the people of Cuba and allowing Global North neocolonizers to resume their pillaging of the nation.

                  What a dumbass turbolib.

            • GarbageShoot [he/him]@hexbear.net
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              9 months ago

              However what is important to remember is that the sanctions are imposed based on the regimes actions against it’s population

              I don’t know every single sanction against the DPRK, but over the last 40 years the sanctions have all been in connection to nuclear development and things like that. Also, it’s rich that you talk about communists being hypocrites while you take western powers at their word for why they are imposing sanctions that starve people by your own admission. The US has done and is doing much crueler things to the people of these states than the states themselves have ever done in any but the most unhinged fantasies.

        • AdeptusPrimaris@lemmy.ml
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          9 months ago

          Very true, it seemed like bad faith arguments. But I’ve learnt quite a lot from the answers to that user’s asinine questions, and I’m sure I’m not the only one

          • MeowZedong@lemmygrad.ml
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            9 months ago

            For sure. It can be useful for others, even if the person you’re interacting with has a rock for a brain.

    • frippa@lemmy.ml
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      9 months ago

      The communist party in Cuba (like every other party) can’t “advertise” itself, it’s in the constitution ffs. If you wanted to pick a socialist country to portray as a “one party scary dictatorship” Cuba is the least fit. Cuba is a zero-party democracy in a way.

    • d-RLY?@lemmy.ml
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      9 months ago

      Obvious troll is obvious. If the overwhelming number of Cuban people really and truly didn’t support socialism. Then they would have taken over in a new revolution as they did getting rid of the US puppet state the last time. They have stood firm despite the literal attempts of US lead colour revolutions and refuse to be forced to bow to the self-appointed global police state that is the US. They aren’t the ones that should change to serve the rich fucks that steal from nations across the world. It is those rich fucks that should be put in the dirt so that peoples across the world could live their lives without fear.

    • keepcarrot [she/her]@hexbear.net
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      9 months ago

      Most countries are actually fine with political parties on the ballot receiving funding, material/technical support, and terrorist attacks from a foreign power, it’s just the perfidious Cubans banning other parties that do this!